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Board index FiveWin for Harbour/xHarbour Using AI Programming Assistance
Posts: 6983
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 07:07 PM
Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2026 02:03 AM

Hello Jonsson,

Thank you for sharing both the conceptual article and the practical example with the kitchen timer. The second post in particular makes the workflow much clearer.

I understand the core idea: move away from “vibe coding” and toward specification-driven development, so that AI assistants generate consistent, traceable code based on explicit intent.

The folder structure (project.md, proposal.md, tasks.md, spec.md, archive, etc.) is well thought out, especially for teams working in modern web stacks.

That said, I have a question regarding practical relevance.

The kitchen timer example is simple and easy to understand, but it does not involve:

database interaction business rules validations legacy constraints or integration into an existing monolithic system

Many of us here work on classic business applications — often monolithic, sometimes DBF-based, sometimes not microservice-oriented, sometimes with only one or two developers involved.

Do you believe OpenSpec really adds value in such environments?

It would be very helpful if you could share a slightly more realistic business example, for instance: a small CRUD module with database access some non-trivial business logic maybe an API endpoint including the actual proposal, tasks, and the prompt used for /openspec-apply

That would make it easier to evaluate where OpenSpec truly shines — especially compared to structured but less formal AI-assisted workflows.

I’m genuinely interested in understanding whether this is mainly an enterprise / multi-team solution, or whether it can also benefit smaller, more traditional development setups.

Best regards, Otto

Posts: 6983
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 07:07 PM
Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2026 02:14 AM

Dear Tim,

over the last few days I’ve been working intensively on migrating one of my largest desktop screens to a smartphone-based solution.

It’s about the biggest screen in my entire application: the customer file. As you can imagine, it contains a large number of fields – structured over many years.

I remember that some time ago you posted a screenshot and mentioned that your input masks were simply too extensive to make sense in a web solution. If I recall correctly, the argument was that the density and complexity of fields would not translate well to a small screen.

Would you mind reposting that screenshot again?

The reason I’m asking is this:

I think I may have found an approach that could make even very large and complex input screens usable on a smartphone — without reducing functionality.

I’m currently experimenting with:

logical grouping instead of full-screen density progressive disclosure (only show what is needed at the moment) contextual sections instead of flat scrolling mobile-first interaction patterns

What I’m starting to realize is that the problem may not be the number of fields — but the way we try to present them.

On desktop, we tend to think in “one big form”. On mobile, it might be more about structured layers.

Before I go further down this path, I’d really like to revisit your earlier example and reflect on it with this new perspective.

Looking forward to your thoughts.

Best regards, Otto

Posts: 410
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 03:30 PM
Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2026 11:44 AM

Otto... buen dia...

En torno a los link, te comento no los he usado... pero llegue a ellos, porque empece a sufrir la problematica de la organizacion, manteniminento, etc de los 5 casos de usos que he tabajado con IA, donde empece a pedirle a la IA, que me generara documentacion de todo promt, refactorizacion, recorderis de lo quedo pendiente, etc.. llegue a esos app. Y en algun webinar se hizo la presentacion de la problematica.. y es realmente una situacion bastante compleja empezar si un tipo de herramientas, como estas,,, ahora que si aplica a desarrollo de software... si , de hecho la presentacion hacia refencia y estaba enfocada casi el 100% a personas , equipos y empresas desarrolladores con multiples colaboradores... ya busco el webinar : ALVARO MOYA

Saludos

Otto... good morning...

Regarding the links, I haven't used them myself... but I came across them because I started experiencing problems with the organization, maintenance, etc., of the five use cases I've worked on with AI. I began asking the AI ​​to generate documentation for everything: prompts, refactoring, reminders of pending tasks, etc. That's how I ended up with those apps. And the problem was presented in a webinar... and it's quite a complex situation to start without tools like these. Now, if it applies to software development... yes, in fact, the presentation was almost entirely focused on individuals, teams, and companies with multiple collaborators... I'll look for the webinar. ALVARO MOYA

Regards

Posts: 410
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 03:30 PM
Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2026 11:52 AM

Otto...

Para moviles :

Para formularios en móviles, la decisión entre usar solo técnicas responsive o un framework especializado como Ionic depende del alcance del proyecto y de la experiencia que quieras ofrecer:

Responsive Design (CSS + HTML)

  • Ventajas:
  • Suficiente para formularios simples en sitios web.
  • Menor complejidad: basta con media queries, flexbox o grid.
  • Compatible con cualquier navegador móvil.
  • No requiere instalar librerías adicionales.
  • Limitaciones:
    • No ofrece acceso nativo a funcionalidades del dispositivo (notificaciones, cámara, GPS).
    • La experiencia puede sentirse como “web adaptada”, no como aplicación móvil.
  • 📱 Frameworks especializados (ej. Ionic)

    • Ventajas:
    • Proporciona componentes optimizados para móviles (inputs táctiles, listas, grids).
    • Mejor integración con gestos, animaciones y estilo nativo.
    • Permite empaquetar la app como híbrida (Android/iOS) usando Capacitor o Cordova.
    • Escalable si luego quieres pasar de un formulario web a una aplicación completa.
  • Limitaciones:
    • Mayor curva de aprendizaje y dependencia del framework.
    • Sobrecarga innecesaria si solo necesitas un formulario sencillo.
    • Requiere mantener actualizaciones del framework y sus dependencias. moldstud.com DEV Community

  • ---

    📊 Comparación rápida

    AspectoResponsive DesignIonic / Framework
    Complejidad inicialBajaMedia/Alta
    Experiencia de usuarioWeb adaptadaCasi nativa
    Acceso a funciones móvilesLimitadoAmplio
    EscalabilidadBajaAlta
    Ideal para…Formularios simplesApps híbridas con más interacción

    ---

    👉 Conclusión práctica:
    Si tu objetivo es solo mostrar y enviar formularios en móviles, con un diseño limpio y adaptable, responsive es suficiente.
    Si planeas que esos formularios sean parte de una aplicación móvil más rica en funcionalidades, con integración nativa y mejor experiencia de usuario, entonces sí conviene usar Ionic u otro framework híbrido.

    ¿Quieres que te prepare un ejemplo de formulario responsive básico en HTML/CSS y otro equivalente con Ionic para que compares la diferencia en código y experiencia?

    Nota : Desde el inicio me enfoque en solucion rapida y efectiva a mis clientes : use un framework especializado : sencha touch ..
    lo mas importante es verlo desde el punto de vista de usuario consumidor que tan comodo se siente con los 2 enfoques...
    Esto llega al tema principal : Uso, rechazo, malestar o abandono de un producto : no funcional , despliegue lento, parpadeo, dificultad para usar, touch (en terminos de usuario consumidor) , ver otras causales ...

    Posts: 6983
    Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 07:07 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2026 11:56 AM

    Jonsson, Yes — this is exactly the problem I have been talking about for some time.

    When AI is introduced into development without structure, things quickly become difficult to manage: prompts get lost, refactorings overlap, context disappears, and projects become harder to maintain instead of easier.

    In my experience, the core issue is not missing AI tools — it is missing architectural structure.

    Harbourino was not created for AI. I was using this modular style long before AI became part of our workflow. But interestingly, it turns out to be extremely AI-friendly.

    By physically splitting code into small, clearly separated responsibility blocks, we reduce context size, side effects, and ambiguity. AI works much more reliably in small, well-defined modules than in monolithic structures.

    For small teams especially, this makes a huge difference:

    easier documentation easier refactoring easier collaboration easier onboarding predictable AI assistance

    So yes — for small teams, Harbourino is not an extra tool. It is simply a structured way of thinking that makes AI manageable.

    Best regards, Otto

    Posts: 2706
    Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 01:50 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2026 02:32 PM

    To All

    Please forgive my personal point of view on Ai .. The human experience is based on the learning of one's own participation in life .. as we grow and exist on this planet our tools have grown exponentially and it is and will always be the Human experience to reach out for new ideas and collaborations however Ai can be a powerful tool but humanity will always have to remember who is the master of technology .. the Human Experience or the machine ..

    Posts: 410
    Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 03:30 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2026 10:46 PM

    Otto, Buena tarde.

    Realimentando tu concepto : vista en pc y mobile , le dije a la IA (Antigravity + gemini 3.1 pro ), que genera vistas
    con FUNCIONALIDAD de mobiles ( touch, gestos, menus, tamaños, uso de dispositivos como camara , lector de huellas, etc) , pero no usando responsive para cuando los disposito detectados sean mobiles ... todo sin reproducir la logica del backend, solo creado componentes en el frontend, tipo "mobile" y de hecho compartiendo logica de backend y de vista : como los servicios, enrutadores, mensajes, auth, etc...

    Sin usar framework externos(IONIC, sencha, etc)




    JONSSON RUSSI

    Posts: 6983
    Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 07:07 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2026 11:20 PM

    Jsonsson, I really like that approach — the future belongs to you and you won’t need anyone anymore.

    Best regards, Otto

    Posts: 410
    Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 03:30 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2026 01:25 AM

    Ya hice la conexion desde el frontEnd a un EndPoint de harbour.. pasando y validando con el backEnd - NodeJs....

    Ya tengo posibIlIdad de solicitar RESTAPI con NODEJS, PYTHON Y MOD_HARBOUR ( )

    // todo pasa por el server nodejs (:3000)
    http://localhost:3000/api/legacy/clientes?codigo=001&nombre=Garcia&limite=20

    o — Apache nunca ve el JWT
    ┌─────────────────────────────────────────────────────┐
    │ FLUJO REAL │
    └─────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘
    Angular NestJS :3000 Apache :80
    │ │ │
    │── Bearer JWT ─────────▶│ │
    │ │ JwtAuthGuard │
    │ │ VALIDA el JWT │
    │ │ (aquí se acepta/ │
    │ │ rechaza con 401) │
    │ │ │
    │ │── SIN JWT ─────────────▶│
    │ │ ?xuser=admin │
    │ │ &
    xempresa=osya01 │
    │ │ &_xyear=2025 │
    │ │ │
    │ │ mod_harbour
    │ │ hb_HGetDef(...)
    │ │◀── JSON response ───────│
    │◀── JSON response ─────│ │
    Resumen de responsabilidades
    Quién Qué hace
    NestJS Valida el JWT (firma, expiración, blacklist)
    NestJS Extrae username y empresa del token
    NestJS Decide si la request llega o no a Apache
    Apache Nunca ve el JWT
    mod_harbour Solo recibe identidad ya validada vía _xuser, xempresa
    mod_harbour Hace la verificación secundaria (IF Empty(cUser)) como defensa extra
    ¿Por qué es seguro?
    Atacante intenta:
    GET http://localhost:80/test_legacy.prg?_xuser=HACKER&_xempresa=osya01

    → Apache responde: "Sin identidad del gateway"
    (porque accedió directo, no tiene los parámetros internos correctos)
    GET http://localhost:3000/api/legacy/ping (sin JWT)
    → NestJS responde: 401 Unauthorized
    → La request NUNCA llega a Apache
    GET http://localhost:3000/api/legacy/ping (con JWT válido)
    → NestJS valida → reenvía a Apache → mod_harbour responde
    Apache solo es accesible a través de NestJS — en producción el puerto 80 de Apache debería estar cerrado al exterior (firewall) o solo escuchar en 127.0.0.1.

    Posts: 38
    Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2022 12:45 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2026 11:19 AM

    Let me tell you about an experiment I did. I use AI, but with paid models. I did an experiment to see how a "normal" user would fare with AI. For this, I used Excel. I opened a template financial spreadsheet that comes with Excel itself. First, I tried with Copilot, because I thought an MS solution should work well with Excel, but after that, it asked me to create a summary tab, an automatic update, and it got lost... it said it would send another "protected" VBA, but nothing happened, the original spreadsheet stopped working. Then I switched to Gemini, which was better, but it got lost, asked me to reinstall Excel, that it was a problem with my version, etc. Then I switched to Antigravity, using Claude Opus 4.5, this one performed better, fixed the errors, the spreadsheet almost became functional, but then... the credits ran out. I tried using other models within Antigravity, but they also started messing up what was working.

    I tried using the free version of Claude, and it seemed promising, but after about 15 minutes the credits ran out. In other words, my conclusion is: anyone not willing to pay $100 to $300 USD/month is out of the running for AI; regular users who don't pay will be very disappointed. And this is with a simple spreadsheet containing VBA code. maybe is otimized to new languages. someone try openclaw?

    Anyone can test this; open a template, ask it to include some fields, request automatic totals, graphs, and automatic search. let me know if work with no paid IA.

    Posts: 476
    Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 06:36 AM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2026 12:21 PM

    Hola Jonsson, que bien se ve las vistas que creaste.

    Saludos cordiales.

    Carlos

    Posts: 410
    Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 03:30 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2026 06:27 PM

    Carlos buena tarde...

    Por ahora son prototipos , dado que todos los gestores los creo de una tabla dbf, donde estan todas las definiciones... debo agregar otros criterios COMO : si se usa en mobil o no , si maneja relacion con otra tabla, si maneja filtros, si maneja paginacion, si genera excel, pdf, si se sincroniza con la version mobil-nativa , etc),,,,las vistas fueron creadas con criterios basicos (vista de fivewin)... pero por ahora,, no he escrito nada de codigo... Mi frontEnd es ANGULAR (primeNg, primeFlex) y para el backEnd NESTJS(nodejs) con opcion de atacar endPoint en FastApi(python) y MOD_HARBOUR V2.1

    Nota : Pagando la novatada de usuario IA... me consumi los primero planes de gemini 3. al segundo dia.....y hoy estoy en plan ULTRA, pero con estrategias creadas por la misma ia,, debemos volver al plan de $20 ,, usen "REDIS", un servidor local sobre DOCKER, para ahorrar tokens...

    Otro problema... la refactorizacion,,, por no tener un plan bien estructurado.... ver en un link anterior.. herramienta para gestionan los N agentes y no caer en el desorden total... Pero bueno estamos aprendiendo....

    Saludos..

    JONSSON RUSSI

    Posts: 44158
    Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 05:47 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2026 07:06 PM

    Estimado JONSSON,

    Puedes conseguir 28 dias gratuitos de Gemini Ultra de esta forma legal:
    https://forums.fivetechsupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=46301

    regards, saludos

    Antonio Linares
    www.fivetechsoft.com
    Posts: 476
    Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 06:36 AM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2026 08:05 PM

    Jonsson, yo utilizo el plan de AI Pro de Google One
    https://one.google.com/u/1/ai?utm_source=antigravity&utm_campaign=argon_limit_reached&pli=1&g1_landing_page=75

    Pago mensual US$ 19.99 (Con un mes gratis al contratarlo)

    Característica Plan AI Pro
    Créditos mensuales 1,000 (Suficiente para desarrollo diario)
    Ventana de Contexto 1 millón de tokens
    Almacenamiento 2 TB en Google One

    Con este plan, nunca me he quedado corto para mis desarrollos.

    Saludos.

    Carlos

    Posts: 410
    Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 03:30 PM
    Re: Using AI Programming Assistance
    Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2026 12:38 AM

    Carlos...

    Mi caso fue particular... me excedí en el cupo diario... y para no perder el resto del día la solución fue pasarme al plan ultra... pero la misma ia, me dijo como ahorrar --- SERVIDOR redis... y propuso un plan a fondo para aprovechar ese plan ... creando todas la herramientas y utilidades, antes de empezar la parte donde requiero empezar a aplicar o a migrar las reglas del negocio - lógica xharbour.. ( trabajo mas pausado)

    También estamos probando con el equipo de desarrollo, CURSOR Y CLAUDE CODE... de u$20

    El gemini del link de antonio es el gemini enterprise (U$30)... ya lo active